B
BlueBeard
Guest
New zoos, old zoos -- doesn't matter. Most of us have been there. Questioning if we're doing something wrong, if we're "bad."
Well, that's a personal question, a matter that depends on the individual, their upbringing, their belief system and... whether they can reconcile all that. Most likely -- unless you're a complete psychopath -- you can't. Not right away. Not immediately.
Some kinds of guilt and shame are good. But a lot of it is unhealthy, is "toxic." How do you know which is which?
Maybe this will help. Two things to add to your reflection. One is from the Bible. One is from a psychotherapist, John Bradshaw, the "hurt people hurt people" guy." But he's not the only psychologist who's mentioned this. Check the concept out for yourself and do a little introspection. If you've been struggling with guilt and shame over being zoo, it just might bring you great relief. (I'm not a psychologist in real life. But I was a bar tender for two years. Same thing???)
Old story
Here's one from the Bible. If that isn't *you* then skip ahead to the psychologist thing:
In Genesis, Adam and Eve suddenly feel shame after doing what God told them not to do. They cover their bodies, suddenly thinking their bodies are shameful and need to be hidden. God is onto them, but rhetorically asks:
"Who told you that you were naked? Have you eaten from the tree that I commanded you not to eat from?"
What's up with that? The author (who was human, by the way, inspired by God or ...just inspired) gives us the clear impression human beings weren't created to feel ashamed of their bodies. We did that to ourselves. That's a *human* thing. And the second thing to unpack there is, they felt shame after they did something wrong. Probably for the first time ever, they did something terribly wrong and wanted to hide their guilt. (Why that's nudity, well... very telling, isn't it? What did eating from the tree have to do with modesty for their naked bodies?)
Just know that you were not created to be ashamed to be naked. Your penis or vagina is no more "evil" than your hand. That's been imposed on us by our own culture, not our "design" and not by our designer.
That's one. Now here comes psychology.
Happy thoughts
Guilt, first of all, is not a bad thing in and of itself. You are SUPPOSED to feel guilty if you do something wrong. It's recognizing we are responsible for something we wish we were not responsible for. If we never felt guilt about anything, we'd be psychopathic and need to be put down.
In short, you don't want to be free of the ability to "feel guilt."
But there's healthy guilt and toxic guilt.
Healthy guilt is a realization you violated your own principles. Say one of your principles is to be a trustworthy person. Then it occurs to you something that you did completely violated someone's trust in you. Well, you *should* feel guilty. You should want to apologize and offer something to restore their trust, let them know "this is not you."
Toxic guilt is taking on responsibility for doing/being "wrong" that you think you are supposed to feel guilty for, but really isn't your "fault." You really didn't do anything wrong. You just think you should feel wrong. So you eat that like a lead pipe. Gives you anguish. (This is my understanding of how this works. Correct me if I'm wrong).
Why do you think looking lustfully at an animal's cock or vagina is "wrong"? Who told you it was wrong? And if you touch it, why is that wrong. If that animal touches, licks or makes yours feel good, why is that "wrong"? Do *you* think it's wrong? Or is that being imposed on you?
When it comes to shame, normal shame is simple modesty. I don't impose my sexuality on others. I don't presume they *want* to see my penis. Or anus. Or activity with an animal. I'm not "ashamed of" these things, but I know people don't want to see this part of me. So... I take measures they don't have to see it.
Toxic shame is feeling that I *have* to hide part of me. If anyone were to discover it, I could not recover from it. Knowledge of it will ruin me beyond repair, should anyone find out. I should maybe even take my own life if they discover this part of me.
Why? If you walk in on me while I'm dressing, healthy shame would say "Oops, sorry! And probably burst out laughing." If the other person can't cope with having seen me naked, or making love to my spouse anally, or with my dog -- that's *their* problem, not mine. I am just being me. Didn't mean for them to see it, but oh well. Move on.
Unhealthy, toxic shame would be to think a line was crossed that can never be uncrossed. Now that someone else knows, I don't want to live anymore. Or can't live here. What should be thought of as *their* problem, I make mine.
Does it help?
If you're having trouble with anguish along these lines, does any of this help you? Simply think to yourself, do the "norms" of society or other people authentically suit you? Are those yours? Simple modesty -- shame -- would indicate, don't have sex with dogs in front of other people. That's private. That's for your own home and special people you can feel secure in sharing that knowledge or even participation with.
And simple guilt, healthy guilt, is knowing where your lines are and not crossing them. If you persist in trying have penetrative sex with an unwilling dog that's whining and trying to get away, I would *hope* that you feel guilt. Knock it off. Reassure the dog that it's okay, it didn't do anything wrong. Reestablish a loving bond. Everything is cool.
But if ... in the heat of a moment ... you succumb to a sexually provocative dog, sate a burning desire that you've had ... and then feel guilty after it's over that you've done something wrong?
Who told you it was wrong? Wrong on what grounds? Where did that come from?
If you're feeling guilty or shameful, it might be healthy, or it might be toxic. You can figure this out. Just ... start by asking, where is that coming from? Articulate for yourself what your values are, what principles underly them. Then don't cross those.
Life gets much more comfortable and stable when its guided by your own, true principles and not some set of constructs others impose upon you but you don't quite believe are valid.
Well, that's a personal question, a matter that depends on the individual, their upbringing, their belief system and... whether they can reconcile all that. Most likely -- unless you're a complete psychopath -- you can't. Not right away. Not immediately.
Some kinds of guilt and shame are good. But a lot of it is unhealthy, is "toxic." How do you know which is which?
Maybe this will help. Two things to add to your reflection. One is from the Bible. One is from a psychotherapist, John Bradshaw, the "hurt people hurt people" guy." But he's not the only psychologist who's mentioned this. Check the concept out for yourself and do a little introspection. If you've been struggling with guilt and shame over being zoo, it just might bring you great relief. (I'm not a psychologist in real life. But I was a bar tender for two years. Same thing???)
Old story
Here's one from the Bible. If that isn't *you* then skip ahead to the psychologist thing:
In Genesis, Adam and Eve suddenly feel shame after doing what God told them not to do. They cover their bodies, suddenly thinking their bodies are shameful and need to be hidden. God is onto them, but rhetorically asks:
"Who told you that you were naked? Have you eaten from the tree that I commanded you not to eat from?"
What's up with that? The author (who was human, by the way, inspired by God or ...just inspired) gives us the clear impression human beings weren't created to feel ashamed of their bodies. We did that to ourselves. That's a *human* thing. And the second thing to unpack there is, they felt shame after they did something wrong. Probably for the first time ever, they did something terribly wrong and wanted to hide their guilt. (Why that's nudity, well... very telling, isn't it? What did eating from the tree have to do with modesty for their naked bodies?)
Just know that you were not created to be ashamed to be naked. Your penis or vagina is no more "evil" than your hand. That's been imposed on us by our own culture, not our "design" and not by our designer.
That's one. Now here comes psychology.
Happy thoughts
Guilt, first of all, is not a bad thing in and of itself. You are SUPPOSED to feel guilty if you do something wrong. It's recognizing we are responsible for something we wish we were not responsible for. If we never felt guilt about anything, we'd be psychopathic and need to be put down.
In short, you don't want to be free of the ability to "feel guilt."
But there's healthy guilt and toxic guilt.
Healthy guilt is a realization you violated your own principles. Say one of your principles is to be a trustworthy person. Then it occurs to you something that you did completely violated someone's trust in you. Well, you *should* feel guilty. You should want to apologize and offer something to restore their trust, let them know "this is not you."
Toxic guilt is taking on responsibility for doing/being "wrong" that you think you are supposed to feel guilty for, but really isn't your "fault." You really didn't do anything wrong. You just think you should feel wrong. So you eat that like a lead pipe. Gives you anguish. (This is my understanding of how this works. Correct me if I'm wrong).
Why do you think looking lustfully at an animal's cock or vagina is "wrong"? Who told you it was wrong? And if you touch it, why is that wrong. If that animal touches, licks or makes yours feel good, why is that "wrong"? Do *you* think it's wrong? Or is that being imposed on you?
When it comes to shame, normal shame is simple modesty. I don't impose my sexuality on others. I don't presume they *want* to see my penis. Or anus. Or activity with an animal. I'm not "ashamed of" these things, but I know people don't want to see this part of me. So... I take measures they don't have to see it.
Toxic shame is feeling that I *have* to hide part of me. If anyone were to discover it, I could not recover from it. Knowledge of it will ruin me beyond repair, should anyone find out. I should maybe even take my own life if they discover this part of me.
Why? If you walk in on me while I'm dressing, healthy shame would say "Oops, sorry! And probably burst out laughing." If the other person can't cope with having seen me naked, or making love to my spouse anally, or with my dog -- that's *their* problem, not mine. I am just being me. Didn't mean for them to see it, but oh well. Move on.
Unhealthy, toxic shame would be to think a line was crossed that can never be uncrossed. Now that someone else knows, I don't want to live anymore. Or can't live here. What should be thought of as *their* problem, I make mine.
Does it help?
If you're having trouble with anguish along these lines, does any of this help you? Simply think to yourself, do the "norms" of society or other people authentically suit you? Are those yours? Simple modesty -- shame -- would indicate, don't have sex with dogs in front of other people. That's private. That's for your own home and special people you can feel secure in sharing that knowledge or even participation with.
And simple guilt, healthy guilt, is knowing where your lines are and not crossing them. If you persist in trying have penetrative sex with an unwilling dog that's whining and trying to get away, I would *hope* that you feel guilt. Knock it off. Reassure the dog that it's okay, it didn't do anything wrong. Reestablish a loving bond. Everything is cool.
But if ... in the heat of a moment ... you succumb to a sexually provocative dog, sate a burning desire that you've had ... and then feel guilty after it's over that you've done something wrong?
Who told you it was wrong? Wrong on what grounds? Where did that come from?
If you're feeling guilty or shameful, it might be healthy, or it might be toxic. You can figure this out. Just ... start by asking, where is that coming from? Articulate for yourself what your values are, what principles underly them. Then don't cross those.
Life gets much more comfortable and stable when its guided by your own, true principles and not some set of constructs others impose upon you but you don't quite believe are valid.
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